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The Incredible Predications of Robert Fleming
which were published in 1701
I have quoted the comments of Albert Barnes about Robert Fleming in my book "A Panorama of the Gospel Age," in Chapter 9 "The Fall of the Papacy." An excerpt appears below. Please read beyond this excerpt: I recently obtained a complete copy of Robert Fleming's works originally called "Apocalyptical Key" and reprinted under the title of "The Rise and Fall of the Papacy." The former historical interpreters have quoted Fleming's predictions relating to the remarkable coincidence of the events of 1848. But even more remarkable are his predictions of events in 1900 and 2000. Read on.
In the quotation Albert Barnes, wrote (1851) at the beginning of the last days of the Papal States.1848 to 1870. during which the States of the Church were taken from the Papal dominion. In 1701 (approximately 150 years previously) Fleming predicted the blow on the Papal States would begin in 1848. Incredibly Garibaldi removed the first portion of the States from the Papacy in 1848, and then a piece at a time, the rest of the territory was lost to Papal dominion culminating in the complete loss of the States under Victor Emmanuel in 1870. Thus 20 years accomplished the predicted event after the stated date of beginning. Read on in Barnes!
"'In this connection I may insert here the remarkable calculation of Robert Fleming, in his work entitled "Apocalyptical Key, or the pouring out of the Vials," first published in 1701. It is in the following words: The 5th Vial which is poured out on the seat of the beast, or the dominions which more immediately belong to and depend on the Roman See; that, I say, this judgment will probably begin about the year 1794 and expire about A.D. 1848; or that the duration of it upon this supposition will be the space of 54 years. For I do suppose that seeing the Pope received the title of Supreme Bishop no sooner than A.D. 606, he cannot be supposed to have any vial poured upon his seat immediately (so as to ruin his authority so signally as this judgment must be supposed to do) until the year 1848, which is the date of the 1260 years in prophetical account when they are reckoned from A.D. 606. But yet we are not to imagine that this will totally destroy the Papacy, (though it will exceedingly weaken it,) for we find that still in being and alive when the next vial is poured out.' Now Barnes': comment: [pp 125, 126 Cobbin's edition] It is a circumstance [says Barnes] remarkably in accordance with this calculation, that in the year 1848 the Pope was actually driven away to Gaeta, [imprisoned] and that at present time (1851) he is restored though evidently with diminished power."
1870 completed the loss of power. It was not until 1929: Well, read another excerpt from my book here quoting me.
The fifth bowl began to be poured on the Papal dominions in 1848 when Garibaldi actually imprisoned the Pope and divested him of his temporal lands. Barnes therefore wrote at the time that this bowl began and did not see the completion of it in 1870 when those dominions were taken by Victor Emmanuel and the Papacy was left with nothing at all in the sense of an earthly state. Sixty or so years after 1870, in 1929, the Papacy would be given sovereign power over the one hundred acre Vatican. In an agreement made with Mussolini in 1929, Vatican city was recognized as a sovereign state and the Pope recognized the kingdom of Italy. The Pope formally accepted one billion, seven hundred fifty million lire for the territory which was taken from him in 1870. He had begun his return to political and temporal authority. They had not repented!
I apologize for taking so long to set the stage but what follows is remarkable indeed. Because Robert Fleming did not stop there in his interpretive predictions. He extended them to the year 2,700 ! What he had to say about the next two periods however is astounding indeed.
Before I describe them I want to remind you that in my book I had predicted the imminent fall of Communism and the Soviet Union which indeed is now in the past. I also predicted that the fall of the Papacy and Islamic nations opening to religious and political freedom are near future events and in fact they are "imminent." What did Robert Fleming think would follow the blow on the "seat of the beast" which he said would begin in 1848 which indeed did happen and was accomplished within 20 years.
Fleming predicted that among the events of the period from 1848 to 1900 would be the decline and extinction of the Turkish Empire! He predicted the events and the dates! in the late 1600's (1692) and published it in 1701! What is even more remarkable is that the decline of the Turkish Empire did occupy the major events of the last half of the 19th century and within less than 20 years after 1900 the Turkish Empire was no more. Its historical lamp was extinguished in 1917. Mr Fleming is truly extraordinary! But that does not end his predictions. What did he think of the next period of history beyond 1917.
Fleming saw the gradual but complete disappearance of the Roman Papacy. But immediately after the fall of The Turkish Empire he sees a spiritual war attempting the complete destruction of the church of Christ as occupying events that lead up to the last part of the 20th century He then predicted that the last half of the 20th century would see the development of events that would be completed by the year 2000 and that the demise of the Papacy would follow shortly as a result! Fleming names 2000 as the terminal point.
Let me sum up Robert Fleming's "historical interpretations" of prophecy.
1. In 1692 he predicted that the 5th vial which would fall on the seat of authority of the Papal system would take place in 1848. It actually did and was completed in 20 years.
2. He predicted that the decline of the Turkish Empire would occupy the last half of the 19th century; the events would be complete by 1900. This indeed is what happened and The Turkish Empire joined the dust bin of history within less than 20 years after1900.
3. Fleming predicted (in 1692) the last half of the 20th century would see the completion of events by the year 2000 that will end the Papacy! Does that mean that within 20 years we should see the complete end of the Papacy? That has been my own conclusion predicted and recorded on tape recordings before 1970 but not in print until 1990. Thus seeing Fleming's complete printed works only recently has amazed me with his insight reaching far beyond his oft quoted analysis of the 5th vial beginning in 1848!Further, incredibly he concluded the same thing that I had arrived at, that is, that the end of the Papacy will be associated with a resurgence of the power of the Christian religion. He so states on page 81 that coincident with the fall of the Papacy will be a parousia similar to the power of Christ in historical time at the destruction of Jerusalem or the end of paganism in 325. Fleming in 1692 concluded that the church of Christ will enjoy a period where opposition to the Gospel will be relatively slight and an unprecedented ingathering of the faithful. Many have heard the same conclusion that I had arrived at independently in the late 1960's. So let it be "even so come Lord Jesus."
addenda. In response to questions:
From: Jim Knutson
To: fmoeller@ao.net
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 6:37 PM
Subject: Re: Flemings' predictions in 1692I love this stuff, Fred. Thank you! Please see my one math problem, below, in my JK to Fred I'm not "getting it" on this one thing.
"of Supreme Bishop no sooner than A.D. 606, he cannot be supposed to have any vial poured upon his seat immediately (so as to ruin his authority so signally as this judgment must be supposed to do) until the year 1848, which is the date of the 1260 years in prophetical account when they are reckoned from A.D. 606. But yet we are not to imagine that this will totally destroy the Papacy,
JK to Fred:
606 + 1260 = 1866, not 1848. What am I missing, here? I am not being contentious. I am not seeing this right. What am I not seeing?Answer:
What Fleming did was to adjust the calculation of the prophetic time relative to the calendar time. The prophecy is calculated in 360 day years which was a calendar year at the time of the initial prophecy and is the limit which was set when the prophecy was first given in Daniel 7 as time times and half a time;
thus 360 times 3 1/2 is 1260. Then in the application he took the extra 5.25 days in an actual Gregorian calendar year and multiplied it by 1260 and divided that by 365.25 days of the actual calendar and then subtracted the product from the date 1866. thus the problem which he correctly perceived needed the adjustment from the time prophecy to the calendar is:
5.25 X 1260 = 6615 then 6615 / 365.25 = 18.1 then 1866 - 18 = 1848
That is the method of calculation and if you think it out you will see that it is necessary to adjust to the change in the calendar from the time that the figure of 1260 days was first given to the calendar in use at the time of the fulfillment.
Fred
******************************From: B.L. Turner
To: fmoeller@ao.net
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 9:45 AM
Subject: Imminence of Islamic freedom
Hi Brother Fred!
Thank you for your e-mail about prophetic issues. Among many other things, you said: "I also predicted that the fall of the Papacy and Islamic nations opening to religious and political freedom are near future events and in fact they are `imminent.'" In your judgement, how soon will the Islamic nations become open to religious and political freedom? You say these cataclysmic events are "imminent." How imminent? At present Islam makes one-fifth of the world's population largely inaccessible to the gospel. May your "imminent" be in our life time! Should it be, will the church be ready to fill the gargantuan spiritual void that Islam has created?
May you enjoy God's rishest blessings!
In the Bond of Christ,
Lee Turner
Answer:I believe that the period that historical interpreters like Barnes, and Fleming foresaw through the pages of the Apocalypse is linked with the fall of Russia as an enemy of the Gospel and that the end of the Papacy as a political state and Islamic nations opening to religious and political freedom will be seen in the future. say in 100 years, looking back, as a part of the same epoch. Thus, imminent means to me, what the article on Fleming implies -- within 20 years after the terminal date of 2000. perhaps as early as 2010.
It must be remembered that IF historical interpreters are correct the termination is also associated with the "hail storm" "And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceedingly great." and as scripture says an "earthquake:" "there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." Thus coincident with the positive things historical interpreters look for is also a PLAGUE, that means a lot of death, and a political revolution of greater proportions than any the world has yet seen. I believe all these events to be imminent within the limits of the definition given above.your question: , will the church be ready to fill the gargantuan spiritual void that Islam has created? Is beyond my ability except as proposed in the original article. A resurgence of the high level of respect for the Christian ethic formerly enjoyed in the western world is part of the period.
All the best
Fred
Oh yes check this out if you have not seen it It is on my cd rom that you have. the location is found by clicking on "A News Article Predating the Fall of the USSR" which is on the "Home page" index. Or on line at:
http://www.ao.net/~fmoeller/winamac.htm"**********************
Fred P Miller
Letter from David Mills
David
I will try to answer your question even though it seems slightly abrupt to me.
"Why, all of a sudden, do we add 20 years to all of Fleming's predictions?"
I suggested: Because the approximate time after the terminal date for 1848 extends to 1870 and is 22 years later; and from 1900 to the completion in 1917 aprox. 17 years and the last date given by Fleming is 2000 and thus I have extrapolated approximately 20 years from his two former "guesses" "I won't be unhappy should it happen" either.
It should also be noted that Mr Fleming did not expect the 2nd coming of Jesus in his near future in fact he placed it beyond 2700. But he is a man and not inspired.. But being "right" in the first two periods, 1848 and 1900, of course is of interest to me since I have proposed the same events for the approximately same period which he postulated more than 300 years ago. That is the reason for
"why all of a sudden?"
---- Original Message -----
From: David R. Mills
Sent: Friday, January 28, 2000 11:27 AM
Subject: Re: Fleming
I have a question about the following:
Let me sum up Robert Fleming's "historical interpretations" of prophecy.
1. In 1692 he predicted that the 5th vial which would fall on the seat of authority of the Papal system would take place in 1848. It actually did and was completed in 20 years.
2. He predicted that the decline of the Turkish Empire would occupy the last half of the 19th century; the events would be complete by 1900. This indeed is what happened and The Turkish Empire joined the dust bin of history within less than 20 years after 1900.
3. Fleming predicted (in 1692) the last half of the 20th century would seethe completion of events by the year 2000 that will end the Papacy! Does that mean that within 20 years we should see the complete end of the Papacy?
"But 1900 was his end terminus for the Turkish Empire and 2000 was his end terminus for the papacy."
No not quite: the dates are the terminus of historical events leading to the end result. The Turkish empire did not expire until 1917. The Papal states suffered their first land loss in 1848 but the land area was not lost to the Papacy until 1870. Thus as the events leading to the loss of termporality were over by 1848 but not complete until 1870 the events leading to the fall of the papacy are all thought by Fleming to be completed by 2000 and the fall of the Papacy will follow accordingly in a period shortly after 2000. I have suggested an extrapolation of 20 years from his earlier good "guesses."
You say: "I understand the first one (1848+20) because Fleming gives that as the beginning terminus. Why add 20 years to these for a "complete" end? Don't get me wrong,